Episode 163

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Published on:

25th Jan 2026

Gun Laws Mostly Burden Law-Abiding Citizens, Not Criminals

Founders let private citizens own warships yet confiscated guns from loyalists. Florida’s waiting periods and limits cut deaths. Jerremy Alexander Newsome and Dave Conley join Richie and Josiah Graves to debate gun law efficacy, enforcement gaps, and how fatherlessness drives crime. They explore mandatory safety courses—but stress most regs hit law-abiding citizens, not criminals.

Timestamps:

  1. (00:00) Founders armed private warships yet seized loyalist guns – 2A was never absolute
  2. (13:11) Continuing education keeps responsible owners sharp – criminals ignore rules anyway
  3. (14:03) Hunter safety courses work – proven training most regs never require

Connect:

  1. Josiah Graves – Website

🌍 Connect with us: Instagram | YouTube | X

Transcript
Alex:

"Registration's just step one to taking them" — Richie says it flat.

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Dave demands competence checks though...

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like doctors license to save lives.

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Criminals skip class either way...

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and good guys pay.

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Dave: So I'd like to dig into this a

little bit to transition us into solutions

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there is no doubt that the founders

beat the biggest empire on earth with

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privately owned warships and cannons.

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And they wrote that Second Amendment

just a few days after requiring

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every man to own a military rifle.

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It was the AR 15 of their day The

other part of this is the founders

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also let towns confiscate guns,

particularly from loyalists.

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Also, quote unquote disorderly persons.

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they banned Catholics.

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they let officers search your house.

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these were the laws of the time.

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today is different.

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Like we already know

felons can't own guns.

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Research does show that

some limits do work.

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Like I live in Florida waiting periods

even magazine limits, red flag laws,

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those do reduce the number of deaths.

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If anything, steelman the other

side of this, but tell me for

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you, does work, what doesn't work?

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Is it the libertarian, no constraints,

no laws or are there some fences, quote

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unquote, that make good neighbors?

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I think I wanna avoid the, all

the guns that seems, hyperbolic,

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that's not even possible.

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But tell me the other side of this.

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Tell me about fences, if anything.

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richie, you wanna start that one?

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Richie: so you said something there

that I literally i'm trying to take

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notes in case I think of something,

but you said felons can't hold guns

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Dave: that is actually among

the only national laws we

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have Felons can't own guns.

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Richie: Is anybody doing anything about

it they can't buy a gun But like you said

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the founding fathers allowed search and

seizure but when have you ever heard of

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oh he's a felon over there Let's go check

and make sure he doesn't have a gun I

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don't know that it happens ever The only

time that the felon gets in trouble for

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having a gun is when he is caught in the

act of doing something and from someone

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who has sold a lot of guns you fill out

a form 44 73 and this is back in the day

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before iPads now it's all done on an iPad

and almost instant And You had to call in

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and they gave you the form and you went

over and you checked the boxes and Are

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you mentally defective Have you ever had

a misdemeanor Have you ever been a, oh

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gosh it's all kinds of questions citizens

Things like that and it's been a while

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since I've looked at one But and then

you made a phone call to the fDLE for

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Florida and you waited and they said all

right approved you wrote your approval

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number down Cool stamp it There's the

gun sale or conditional meaning Hey we've

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got a waiting period We need to look

deeper into this person we'll call you

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back We have three days before you can

release this firearm stamp it or denial

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Now they can never tell you why that was

the extent of what we knew when we were

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doing the 44 73 and the background checks.

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Dave: Yeah.

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Richie: So I guess to your question of

what can be done don't know But what I do

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know is nothing is being done to stop the

people that aren't supposed to have them

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from having them does that make sense Yeah

there's, and that's I would say that's

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a, our justice system in general right

Like the stat with Illinois 80 had prior

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arrest records they're still getting a

gun from somewhere and I know the question

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is if you do the gun show loophole or the

private sale loophole where I can walk up

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to you and say Hey I've got a gun You want

buy it 600 bucks here you go What how do

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I know you're a felon or not and it's I

don't feel that it is my job to police it

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as a private citizen like I I don't know

the right way there I don't think that you

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should stop that because if my dad wants

to sell me a gun is he not allowed to

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Dave: Well, Rich, so you're

saying I'm here in enforcement.

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So what does enforcement mean?

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Does that mean.

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Background checks.

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Does that mean if, like you're on, you're

in psychiatric counseling or you're

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taking psychiatric medications, then Yeah.

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Should, should guns be, locked up by maybe

a a gun dealer or local law enforcement.

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So what does enforcement mean to you

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Richie: It's a slippery slope because

I know that the nras Big thing and

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a lot of gun owners thing is if

we give an inch they take a mile

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Dave: Yeah

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Richie: And part of red flag

laws that are so scary is if you

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called the police department tomorrow

and Baker acted me guess what there goes

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my right to own a gun for a while and

that's just you doing it Now were you

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doing it because you think I'm a piece

of shit and You don't agree with me,

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Or do I really have a mental illness

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Josiah: is guilty until proven innocent.

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Richie: Exactly And so I think law

abiding gun owners are afraid that if we

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say 'cause I do agree that there could

be some tightening in certain areas.

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I don't know what that looks like I don't

know what that is because we've seen the

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government, we've seen all kinds of things

where it gets taken further and deeper

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every single time case in point like the

red flag deal somebody listening to this

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podcast could literally baker act me and

then I'm now no longer allowed to own

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a gun because I'm adjudicated mentally

defective which if I put no on the 44 73

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I'm now breaking a federal law I don't

know your answer and I don't have an

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answer for you I just know that it is a

extremely slippery slope and it can go

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really bad really quick for a good person

following the law I guess that's my answer

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Jerremy: Yeah, that was a great answer.

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You're also saying, and I heard you

say I meaning like you would be okay

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if it was structured the right way.

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If it was proposed the correct

way, you'd be all right for some

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additional enforcement of some kind.

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example, every year you have to

register your car, you gotta pay a

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registration fee, and that goes directly

to the state, the county, whoever.

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Would you be willing to do something

like that with a gun every year where

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you pay some X amount of dollars,

$20 to say, Hey, I still have it.

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I still own it.

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And that $20 goes to a mental health

organization or the Veteran's Affairs

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Act where we actually can pour into

the mental stability of our citizens.

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Richie: So this is where you May

disagree with me, but No, it is not a

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Josiah: law abiding yeah

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Richie: Exactly it is My second amendment

right to own those guns I don't have

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to tell you how many I have because the

criminals that have em illegally aren't

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gonna do that so that just defeats

the purpose and you're only penalizing

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the law abiding citizens it is not a

an amendment to own a vehicle that's

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a luxury so I would differ on that.

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I don't know because I again, it

is a very slippery slope I just

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spit balling shot in the dark here.

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Let's say you had a felony and

you can no longer own a gun and

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you, 'cause technically your

guns are halfway registered.

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When you fill out a 44 73, they put

the serial number down on it There is

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database that you can back on and see.

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Okay, Richie Swell bought that

gun now whether I have it anymore

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or Not, that's two different

things, but it is to my name.

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So if you commit a felony, maybe

I don't know, pretty intrusive.

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But number one, you have

to give up your guns.

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Number two, there should be annual

checks of do you have a gun?

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And that's just a shot in the dark.

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And I don't necessarily know that

I agree with it, but talk about

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enforcement, but you committed the felony.

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So, you know, I didn't commit the felony.

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I don't know.

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I really don't.

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there's not a perfect

answer to it 'cause sure.

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Do you know why I think

you don't know Richie?

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Why?

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'cause again, there is no way to

legislate evil out of this world.

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True.

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Josiah: And I think the flaw

in the question is how can

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we get this down to zero?

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Dave: I can say the craziest stuff, right?

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And yet there are fences on that, right?

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I can't libel you, I can't,

you know, I can't try to sell

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you, swamp here in Florida.

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You know, like all of those

things are illegal and yet

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technically they're free speech.

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You know, so like everything has a fence

as gun owners, as people who are like,

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this is my right, and I agree with you.

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What are those fences that you'd be okay

with that also helps, protect and the

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safety and maybe people who, who don't

own guns, you know, like what, what kind

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of fence would you be okay with, if any?

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Josiah: Yeah, I think he hit it

on the head with the enforcement

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of what we've already got, right?

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Because those are people who've

already shown a capacity, right?

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I think we need to tighten up on, again,

what he talked about, was it 80% people

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already had, offenses and a long sheet?

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how are we letting rap

sheets get that long?

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Now, again, I don't know enough

about, that, but how is somebody

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out there running around who has 15

arrests in the first place, right?

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That seems like a good place to start.

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To me.

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I agree.

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I'm totally against red flag

laws because again, that's just,

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too much of a slippery slope.

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It's guilty until proven innocent.

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And the other stuff that

we're talking about, like what

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Jerremy brought up, right?

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The $20, kind of re-report

everything every year, right?

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It's not about the cost of it

or even the hassle of reporting

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it, it's who's gonna do that?

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All your law abiding citizens are

gonna do the people you're not

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worried about going out and committing

one of these atrocities, right?

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Somebody who would do that.

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The likelihood of them actually

acquiescing to that requirement

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is probably pretty nil, right?

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So it's, you know, again, it's

this idea that we're going to just

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be able to legislate evil away.

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I think there are bigger root causes that

we could address than the guns themselves.

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Kind of like this

conversation started off.

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Yeah.

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You know, fatherlessness is a huge one.

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You know what is fueling

the fatherlessness epidemic

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in this country, right?

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That makes for a big swath of things

going off the rails with developing youth.

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Not having a father in the picture.

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That to me would have a much

more massive systemic impact

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Jerremy: mm-hmm.

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Josiah: On our culture as a whole

than again, clamping down access to

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an inanimate object that everybody

who's going to participate in those

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restrictions anyways are Already

proving themselves responsible.

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Dave: So this is what I'm hearing,

and correct me if I'm wrong that the

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laws we have now aren't either being

enforced or they're not working for

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you, or they could lead to more issues.

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And so we should have fewer of the laws

like red flag laws or less on that, and

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we should make sure felons don't own guns.

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Richie: Yeah.

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Josiah: On the spot?

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Yeah.

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I think that's a good starting point.

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Richie: Yeah.

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And to speak to the registration

and stuff between:

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there were over 92,000 firearms

confiscated without serial numbers.

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So registering 'em doesn't

do anything anyway.

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Yeah.

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You know?

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Mm-hmm.

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Whether that be a ghost

gun or it was filed off,

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Josiah: Sure,

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Richie: Filed Off.

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Yeah.

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Um, and so it is, it's one of those things

where you're damned if you do, damned

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if you don't, in a lot of aspects of it.

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And, Josiah said it perfectly, I think

there are other issues at play that the

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guns are getting their fingers pointed at.

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Like, why?

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Just redirecting for two seconds and

let me go off on my little tangent.

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Doctors kill 250,000 people

a year for malpractice.

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Jerremy: Mm-hmm.

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Richie: I haven't heard the

first let's get rid of a doctor.

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Josiah: and that's that consistency.

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Richie: And we're talking about, and I

know that I'm not this type of person,

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but I'm just gonna say facts here,

we're talking about 46,000 people a year

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Dave: Yeah, I hear you.

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But doctors are also licensed.

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And they can lose that license and

they require continuing education.

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Is it too much to say that if you're

a gun owner, you are licensed?

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Right.

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And you have to do continuing education.

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as another citizen, if you own a

weapon, I wanna make sure you are

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completely up on all the laws, that

you are a super citizen because you

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have a super responsibility with a gun.

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I wanna make sure that you understand

the laws and I wanna make sure that

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you know how to use that weapon.

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Is that too much to ask?

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Richie: So my question to you is,

has malpractice gone down with the

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continuing education and the licensing?

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Dave: I don't know, but I'm gonna guess

that there's a lot of crappy doctors

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out there that are no longer practicing.

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I mean, I can't prove the negative,

but I'm gonna say that's my,

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you know, like, that's my point.

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we have better doctors with those

contingencies than I would, you know,

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like if, if my doctor was not licensed

and you know, had had a bunch of issues

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and you know, like I wouldn't go to a

doctor who didn't go to medical school.

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I'm asking you to make sure that

everybody goes to a gun school.

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Is that okay?

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Richie: So if you want to hunt, you

have to go do a hunter safety course.

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Dave: Great,

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Richie: right?

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Mm-hmm.

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And that is required to be able

to hunt and get a hunting license.

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Jerremy: Yeah.

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Richie: I don't see an issue with,

if you're gonna buy a gun, you need

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to go through a gun safety course.

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I don't see an issue with that.

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I, I think that could only help.

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it does a number of things.

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It actually opens up job opportunity.

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It gives people that are professionals

in the industry or with firearms,

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you know, the opportunity to teach.

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Same with how it used to be to

get a concealed carry permit.

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You had to go through concealed

carry class, you had to take a

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test, and then you had to go to the

range with an instructor and fire.

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So it's kind of already there.

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I don't know how all states are.

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I know Florida used to be that way

to get your concealed, and I think

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even with the open carry to get a

concealed carry permit in Florida,

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you still have to go through that.

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I would not be opposed to that because

like hunters do it and they do it, you

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know, that's like a rite of passage for

the 13 to 14-year-old fixing to get his

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hunting license when he turns 16 or 17.

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So I don't see an issue with it.

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but with every bad apple, there's

gonna people that just sign off,

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collect the 30 bucks and move on.

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Josiah: And using the, the

doctor analogy again, to your

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point you said the CEUs right?

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And the licensing and all that

kind of stuff does make for better

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doctors than if we didn't have that.

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Right.

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What does that I'm, I'm saying I wouldn't,

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Dave: I wouldn't go to a doctor

who didn't go to medical school

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and didn't keep up on things.

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Josiah: absolutely.

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I wouldn't either.

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Yeah.

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But there are people who do.

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Sure.

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So my question was going to be, what

about all the people who are out there

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practicing medicine that aren't licensed?

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What do regulations like that do for them?

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To me that's kind of the

equivalent for mm-hmm.

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The criminal sector in

the gun conversation.

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What is legislating the good

people who are gonna participate

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do for the segment of society that

we're actually trying to impact?

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My question and I just to be really

clear here, I don't have an answer.

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Yeah.

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But I've not seen, or I've not seen

or heard of a piece of legislation

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that I'm like, oh my gosh, that

will fix the actual problem.

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Yeah.

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It's always the guns we're going after.

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It's never the people.

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Jerremy: Yeah.

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Only My whole topic and my whole

belief, my whole narrative is gonna come

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down to it's being generally at some

point sensationalized by our leaders

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or essentially lack of leadership.

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Alex: Training rules

circle — criminals never enroll.

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Jerremy points quiet to

fatherlessness stats......

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to homes with no dad at all.

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That's the variable no policy reaches.

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Solving America's Problems
Solving America’s Problems isn’t just a podcast—it’s a journey. Co-host Jerremy Newsome, a successful entrepreneur and educator, is pursuing his lifelong dream of running for president. Along the way, he and co-host Dave Conley bring together experts, advocates, and everyday Americans to explore the real, actionable solutions our country needs.

With dynamic formats—one-on-one interviews, panel discussions, and more—we cut through the noise of divisive rhetoric to uncover practical ideas that unite instead of divide. If you’re ready to think differently, act boldly, and join a movement for meaningful change, subscribe now.